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sg
3 thumbs up
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
Posts: 11030
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 Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 11:42 am Post subject: |
 #61 |
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H4, AT, FL, TFL, AWCL, CL, FSL, RLF, TUR, X-C
Aeros Stealth III 142
| Thomas Jefferson wrote: |
| All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent. |
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red
3 thumbs up
Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 2739
Location: Utah, USA . . . . . . . . . . . . . Sol III
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 11:47 am Post subject: Re: Doing everything wrong, but how about some input? |
#62 |
jbaloh,
My point is, there IS your long tow rope, big field, and nice new glider. WHY didn't *any* of that good stuff prevent a vertical lockout? Your field is NOT that big, your tow rope is NOT that long, and your glider is NOT that new. It takes KNOWLEDGE, not guesswork, to be safe. Better get sum, and sooner, not later. You only get one body; bust it up bad enough, and they can't fix it any more. Visit an orthopedic hospital, if you doubt that. People will be leaving there, praising God that they can even hobble out to the car. Does that sound good to you?
I know your glider. I taught HG to students with SeaHawks, and if it was not a very good trainer, then you would not look the same, by now. It STILL requires periodic maintenance, as *any* wing will. It is NOT safe now. The scary part is that you do not even know what's wrong with it, or you would have fixed a few things. It isn't even in good flying trim, and it should be, *especially* for towing.
Nice videos. That's enough bravery, to suit me. Now it's time to get smart, instead of lucky. Learn all you can about towing, and I do not mean the hard way (lessons from the School of Hard Knocks will cost you 'WAY too much). I wish you the best.
| jbaloh wrote: |
| jbaloh wrote: |
Ok so our glider is now for sale 500 bux lol who wants it, probably no one on here
i dont understand why everyone says its so dangerous, we didnt have any problems what so ever, i know you say we are lucky that we didnt have an equipment failure, but with a newer wing what are the dangers? I think with such a large field its very easy to avoid lockout by keeping the speed of climb and rope tension lower...
So seriously I need to buy a new glider... i would even like to move up to a high performance one, or intermediate.... |
| red wrote: |
jbaloh, everybody wants a higher performance wing. Unless you learn on easier wings, first, though, you do not have much chance of success. Most pilots here realize that.
Having no problems does not mean it was safe; it only means you were lucky. Hospital bills can cost 'WAY more than lessons. For the picture below (scroll down):
This is a big field (dry lake bed in Nevada).
This is a new, high performance glider.
This is a long tow rope.
This is a vertical lockout, which can turn into a horizontal lockout, then a deadly crash. That can all happen within seconds, and the pilot won't have much to say about it, as it happens. The videos in this thread PROVE that, man. |
see that right there looks like trouble to me, if the rope snapped he would be in a vertical climb. We have been to cloud nine and watched them do some aero tows and got a little advice. we arent going to fly this glider anymore but we for sure will be doing our own tows as well as flying with some lessons. |
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Cheers,
........Red.........................
Pssst! New pilot? Free advice, maybe worth the price,
http://www.xmission.com/~red/
H4, Moyes X2, Falcon Tandem, HES Tracer, Quantum |
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bradgeary
1 thumbs up
Joined: 09 May 2008
Posts: 219
Location: SAN DIEGO!
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 12:14 pm Post subject: |
#63 |
WOW this guy.........  
He's trying to improve the gene pool. 
You NEED lessons!!!!!! or you WILL without a doubt be HURT or KILLED on any glider!!!!!
I watched a guy form the air show up to a local site and took a wile to get of the hill during very late day glass off conditions. Turns out he had taken a few lessons and thought he could figure it out from there on his own. After a short scary flight (where I was yelling at him quit getting so close and get the fkcu away from me) he was hauled off the hill in a helicopter with a broken back, elbow, and rib(s).
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SKY PIMP
http://vimeo.com/user942728/videos |
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jbaloh
Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Posts: 37
Location: Howell, mi
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 12:28 pm Post subject: |
#64 |
sounds like all these accidents were caused by lack of common sense.. anyway i will get some training as well as a newer wing, this is just how i got started like back in the day, and for as bad as you guys make it sound i should have died just looking at it. But it flew and so did we... so now we will continue with newer stuff and some instruction.
thanks again. |
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sg
3 thumbs up
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
Posts: 11030
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 12:36 pm Post subject: |
#65 |
One day you will look back at this and think "I played russian roulette and WON, wheeew" 
After all, 5 out of 6 people win at a single round of russian roulette 
(but I still dont like those odds )
_________________
H4, AT, FL, TFL, AWCL, CL, FSL, RLF, TUR, X-C
Aeros Stealth III 142
| Thomas Jefferson wrote: |
| All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent. |
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jbaloh
Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Posts: 37
Location: Howell, mi
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 12:40 pm Post subject: |
#66 |
| We flew more than 20 times with no incident, thats a little more than luck... well since everyone hated this so much im going to video me flying it to 2500 and then cut away and parachute down... so if a seagull lands in your back yard, you should tow yourself up on it lol. |
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knumbknuts
3 thumbs up
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 5004
Location: Carlsbad, CA
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 12:49 pm Post subject: |
#67 |
| sg wrote: |
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jbaloh
Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Posts: 37
Location: Howell, mi
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:04 pm Post subject: |
#68 |
thanks for the responses and people who were actually helpful in this forum. I will be around longer than a few of you think... i really enjoyed our short flights and will be at cloudbase before you know it.
thanks for the message, ill leave your name out but this was nice to read.
"you guys DID do something amazing in that Seagull with missing parts and improvised towing equipment, but I salute you jbaloh. I am VERY glad neither of you was hurt, and don't want to discourage you two (but stay low in it and don't get higher than you could survive the fall. What you did is what made the sport happen in the first place. I wouldn't do it anymore, but I'm glad there are still pilots like you out there. Talented, smart (you obviously had a plan, read up, watched videos, and took it slow), and thumbsup willing to take some chances.
I hope to fly with you someday. I'll bet you'll be the guy to follow to find the good lift",
from my inbox . |
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spekkinout
3 thumbs up
Joined: 29 Jun 2007
Posts: 593
Location: BC Canada
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:08 pm Post subject: |
#69 |
| jbaloh wrote: |
| We flew more than 20 times with no incident, thats a little more than luck... |
Hate to burst your bubble, but you've got it wrong, you put that "a" in there...it should read "that's little more than luck".
You seem to be seeing this as something along the lines of...man, we must be naturals, amazing pilots, we pulled this off no problem while all these guys are saying we'd pile in.
That is not at all the case. You're just lucky, plain and simple. Incredibly lucky, in fact, given the state of your gear and your obvious lack of knowledge.
Glad to see you are planning on instruction and newer equipment. You might just make it as an HG pilot. The sport thanks you. |
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knumbknuts
3 thumbs up
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 5004
Location: Carlsbad, CA
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:13 pm Post subject: |
#70 |
| jbaloh wrote: |
| We flew more than 20 times with no incident, thats a little more than luck... well since everyone hated this so much im going to video me flying it to 2500 and then cut away and parachute down... so if a seagull lands in your back yard, you should tow yourself up on it lol. |
Oh, don't be so passive-aggressive. If we hated you, we'd either not say anything, place side bets on how long it would take you to auger in (I want next Tuesday), or ask you if we can have your stuff when you're done. |
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day dreamer
2 thumbs up
Joined: 04 Dec 2007
Posts: 3744
Location: McClure Pilot
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:26 pm Post subject: |
#71 |
| Wagner24314 wrote: |
| dude i just looked ther is a HG instructor in your back yard tracy tillman |
*bump*
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Always a student.
"The mountain doesn't care what that card in your wallet says." - Bruce Stobbe |
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Pete B
3 thumbs up
Joined: 09 May 2008
Posts: 713
Location: The wetlands, UK
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:31 pm Post subject: |
#72 |
"Distrust any enterprise that requires new clothes"
Henry David Thoreau 1817-1862 |
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jbaloh
Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Posts: 37
Location: Howell, mi
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:45 pm Post subject: |
#73 |
| so i havent heard what exactly will go wrong out of anyone.. the weather wasnt bad and we had the whole lockout thing covered, granted our equip is old but it held up, is that what we were lucky about? |
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day dreamer
2 thumbs up
Joined: 04 Dec 2007
Posts: 3744
Location: McClure Pilot
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:52 pm Post subject: |
#74 |
| day dreamer wrote: |
| Wagner24314 wrote: |
| dude i just looked ther is a HG instructor in your back yard tracy tillman |
*bump* |
_________________
Always a student.
"The mountain doesn't care what that card in your wallet says." - Bruce Stobbe |
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hgflyer
3 thumbs up
Joined: 07 Dec 2007
Posts: 3425
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:53 pm Post subject: |
#75 |
| jbaloh wrote: |
| so i havent heard what exactly will go wrong out of anyone.. the weather wasnt bad and we had the whole lockout thing covered, granted our equip is old but it held up, is that what we were lucky about? |
Without experience and developed knowledge and skills.
All of the above and then some. All accidents happen because of one or multiple factors going wrong. Experience and training help pilots become familiar with all factors. And learning to apply skill and knowledge in all areas of flight (factors). So when we fly, we optimize all of the factors that might work against us.
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The sky is no longer the limit! Only our imaginations will be our limit! |
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knumbknuts
3 thumbs up
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 5004
Location: Carlsbad, CA
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:54 pm Post subject: |
#76 |
| jbaloh wrote: |
| so i havent heard what exactly will go wrong out of anyone.. the weather wasnt bad and we had the whole lockout thing covered, granted our equip is old but it held up, is that what we were lucky about? |
If you have to ask that, this man will tell you shortly:
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hgflyer
3 thumbs up
Joined: 07 Dec 2007
Posts: 3425
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 2:13 pm Post subject: |
#77 |
I do support your enthusiasm. Once a person is bitten with the enthusiasm this sport can bring. It can be devestating for some (more is not enough). Use your enthusiasm to stay motivated to learn from experienced pilots. It does take time to develope the experience, skills and knowledge. It also takes time to have a bad experience (only 5 seconds).
Keep us posted on your progress. Good luck to you. I'm the worse person to talk about luck. If you feel flying is mostly luck.
_________________
The sky is no longer the limit! Only our imaginations will be our limit! |
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jbaloh
Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Posts: 37
Location: Howell, mi
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 2:19 pm Post subject: |
#78 |
| hgflyer wrote: |
I do support your enthusiasm. Once a person is bitten with the enthusiasm this sport can bring. It can be devestating for some (more is not enough). Use your enthusiasm to stay motivated to learn from experienced pilots. It does take time to develope the experience, skills and knowledge. It also takes time to have a bad experience (only 5 seconds).
Keep us posted on your progress. Good luck to you. I'm the worse person to talk about luck. If you feel flying is mostly luck. |
i dont believe in luck, you make your own, and yes i do agree if you jump into something without looking into it, you will fail. |
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hgflyer
3 thumbs up
Joined: 07 Dec 2007
Posts: 3425
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 2:37 pm Post subject: |
#79 |
| jbaloh wrote: |
| hgflyer wrote: |
I do support your enthusiasm. Once a person is bitten with the enthusiasm this sport can bring. It can be devestating for some (more is not enough). Use your enthusiasm to stay motivated to learn from experienced pilots. It does take time to develope the experience, skills and knowledge. It also takes time to have a bad experience (only 5 seconds).
Keep us posted on your progress. Good luck to you. I'm the worse person to talk about luck. If you feel flying is mostly luck. |
i dont believe in luck, you make your own, and yes i do agree if you jump into something without looking into it, you will fail. |
I wish you nothing but good information (instruction) and positive experiences. So you can be a keeper of the flame for the next enthusiastic pilot.
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The sky is no longer the limit! Only our imaginations will be our limit! |
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red
3 thumbs up
Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 2739
Location: Utah, USA . . . . . . . . . . . . . Sol III
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 3:02 pm Post subject: Doing everything wrong, but how about some input? |
#80 |
| jbaloh wrote: |
| so i havent heard what exactly will go wrong out of anyone.. the weather wasnt bad and we had the whole lockout thing covered, granted our equip is old but it held up, is that what we were lucky about? |
jbaloh,
Man, there are HUNDREDS if not thousands of tow instructors and tow pilots who WANT to know how you did that ! ! !
PLEASE let all of us dummies know, because towing lockouts are all too common, and we really need to learn how to avoid these disasters!
Okay,
The glider can lock out (No problem for you,though. Ya GOTTA tell us how!)
The old glider can break something (not when you're LUCKY, though).
With no dive recovery system, the glider can stall, then dive steeper than the pilot can recover from, without a working Dive Recovery System to help. (The sky does not accept excuses, like "I didn't know...)
The tow rope can break.
The tow release can fail to release. (No hook knife? No LinkKnife? NO excuses!) You will have a tow-rope radius dive, into the dirt.
The tow vehicle can malfunction, seize the engine, or otherwise stop, and again you will have a tow-rope radius dive into the dirt. Running out of gas can be a death-penalty offense -for the PILOT!
The glider can lift and flip the tow vehicle, especially when the glider hits lifting air (dust devil) and again, you will have a tow-rope radius dive into the dirt. Of course, the extra load of lifting the tow vehicle could break the glider at altitude, also.
The tow driver can have a medical malfunction (wasp in the eye, et c.).
And I'm sure the pilots here can add many more. We are not keeping secrets, really, but the list is kinda long...
_________________
Cheers,
........Red.........................
Pssst! New pilot? Free advice, maybe worth the price,
http://www.xmission.com/~red/
H4, Moyes X2, Falcon Tandem, HES Tracer, Quantum |
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