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NMERider
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 3:13 pm    Post subject: Wish They All Looked Like This.... Reply with quote #1   
Somebody please volunteer to drive me to the training hill launch a few hundred times so they all look like this rather than it being an exception from 2010. good idea

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Lucky_Chevy
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote #2   
It always feels good to nail a landing. In fact, I've had epic flights (for me) where a crappy landing upstaged the moment.

And your buddies always ask:
You flew how far?
How many hours in the air?
How high?
...and you nailed the landing...right?
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designbydave
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote #3   
I'll volunteer for $100
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NMERider
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote #4   
Lucky_Chevy wrote:
It always feels good to nail a landing. In fact, I've had epic flights (for me) where a crappy landing upstaged the moment.

And your buddies always ask:
You flew how far?
How many hours in the air?
How high?
...and you nailed the landing...right?

Yes, there's nothing worse than defiling a landing at the end of an epic flight. At least I didn't flub up this promotional drag chute landing at the end of this 61-mile OnR flight: https://youtu.be/nuPaNuWNJyE?t=3h7m35s
I've massacred my share of downtubes at the end of some really great flights.
My buddies no longer ask me if I nailed the landing on my X/C flights. Instead, they ask me things like, "How was the food in the hospital?" or "Did you see the reading on the Richter scale at the Cal Tech seismological lab?". It's good to have friends who keep our egos in check for us. My favorite is to stick a great landing at the end of a big flight and to walk over by the beer cooler and everyone says in perfect unison, "Oh hey, we didn't even know you came in". punch ROFL

I need to get back in the air badly, but then who here doesn't?

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NMERider
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote #5   
designbydave wrote:
I'll volunteer for $100
How much for the use of the Gator on top of that? If Shaggy was able to to 28 launches from the 90' then I want the same service. I'll even use my own glider and harness.
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designbydave
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote #6   
NMERider wrote:
designbydave wrote:
I'll volunteer for $100
How much for the use of the Gator on top of that? If Shaggy was able to to 28 launches from the 90' then I want the same service. I'll even use my own glider and harness.


I'm sure we can arrange something.

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AIRTHUG
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote #7   
Have you analyzed that landing VS your many others, and noted any differences?

I see a couple right away... but sometimes it helps to know where to look and what to look for (and I have done/still do a lot of landing video geek study)

Your flare motion is slower and smoother- and the glider responds by rotating nose-up slower. This allows it to transfer kinetic energy (airspeed) into potential energy (altitude/height) more efficiently than a quick nose-up rotation. Using gravity as your ally this time, that upward momentum is quickly eliminated, and at the moment of stall the mass of entrained air was being lifted upward some before becoming detached from the wing- and so it either goes over you as the glider settles, or creates a brief effect of rising air to soften that small decent onto your feet. The glider also tail-slides for a moment after the climbing flare, which would certainly help eliminate any remaining forward airspeed (due to the twist in the wing, the tailslide after flaring can result in a negative horizontal (backwards) force.

So, I see the flare was performed differently than your other landings... and you had very good timing, which certainly helps- just the right amount of energy to climb to a stop just barely above the ground for a gentle hop onto your feet thumbsup

Nice one!

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Avolare
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 4:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote #8   
Nice!
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Nicos
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote #9   
I thought you should have pulled in... or pushed out more. Other than that, a sweet landing mosh
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NMERider
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote #10   
Nicos wrote:
I thought you should have pulled in... or pushed out more. Other than that, a sweet landing mosh
Push up not out. Laughing
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NMERider
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote #11   
Avolare wrote:
Nice!
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NMERider
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote #12   
AIRTHUG wrote:
Have you analyzed that landing VS your many others, and noted any differences?

I see a couple right away... but sometimes it helps to know where to look and what to look for (and I have done/still do a lot of landing video geek study)

Your flare motion is slower and smoother- and the glider responds by rotating nose-up slower. This allows it to transfer kinetic energy (airspeed) into potential energy (altitude/height) more efficiently than a quick nose-up rotation. Using gravity as your ally this time, that upward momentum is quickly eliminated, and at the moment of stall the mass of entrained air was being lifted upward some before becoming detached from the wing- and so it either goes over you as the glider settles, or creates a brief effect of rising air to soften that small decent onto your feet. The glider also tail-slides for a moment after the climbing flare, which would certainly help eliminate any remaining forward airspeed (due to the twist in the wing, the tailslide after flaring can result in a negative horizontal (backwards) force.

So, I see the flare was performed differently than your other landings... and you had very good timing, which certainly helps- just the right amount of energy to climb to a stop just barely above the ground for a gentle hop onto your feet thumbsup

Nice one!

The most notable differences that come to find on this and the few other good landings I've eked out over the years are:
1 - Light grip with open hands
2 - Hands slide up and down easily as needed
3 - Hands are raised up during skim until higher than both ears
3 - The nose is raised so that the glider runs out of energy along a straight trajectory
4 - The glider is guided to a stop in the air and falls out of the sky

That open hand position throughout the entire landing approach has always been the key. I've heard this from other pilots who are very consistent. I was wearing grippy gaffer gloves yet my hands slide around easily. That tells me my touch was light and I wasn't grabbing. This can easily be practiced while flying at altitude and as silly as it sounds can also be practiced while standing indoors holding an imaginary control frame. If I'm grabbing any part of the control frame I have little idea what the glider is really doing. Hopefully this helps me build better and more consistent technique.

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aeroexperiments
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote #13   
AIRTHUG wrote:
Have you analyzed that landing VS your many others, and noted any differences?

I see a couple right away... but sometimes it helps to know where to look and what to look for (and I have done/still do a lot of landing video geek study)

Your flare motion is slower and smoother- and the glider responds by rotating nose-up slower. This allows it to transfer kinetic energy (airspeed) into potential energy (altitude/height) more efficiently than a quick nose-up rotation. Using gravity as your ally this time, that upward momentum is quickly eliminated, and at the moment of stall the mass of entrained air was being lifted upward some before becoming detached from the wing- and so it either goes over you as the glider settles, or creates a brief effect of rising air to soften that small decent onto your feet. The glider also tail-slides for a moment after the climbing flare, which would certainly help eliminate any remaining forward airspeed (due to the twist in the wing, the tailslide after flaring can result in a negative horizontal (backwards) force.

So, I see the flare was performed differently than your other landings... and you had very good timing, which certainly helps- just the right amount of energy to climb to a stop just barely above the ground for a gentle hop onto your feet thumbsup

Nice one!


Wow that's quite some analysis Ryan--the mass of entrained air is lifted upward--??

Not saying that you are right, or wrong--

Interesting, thanks for sharing

Steve
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AIRTHUG
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote #14   
Not an original thought to me- Roy Haggard pointed it out to me a while back, in a landing clinic I was giving for Wills Wing @ Wallaby

If you've ever had a no-wind flare where you *didn't* climb a little, came to mostly a standstill, but then felt as though you got pushed over from behind... that was the mass of entrained air that was attached to your wing and being pulled along with you ("drag"). We flare, stall, separate the airflow... but an object in motion, will remain in motion... and so that chunk of air keeps right on moving- in the direction it & you were going before it was separated from you (stall).

Roy's a hellofa smart dude mosh

I had known/experienced the bit about feeling the air slam in to the back of us right after flaring... and I knew a slightly-climbing flare works WAY better for coming to a complete stop (I call it a "1/4 loop flare")... but Roy brought attention to the entrained air, and it's difference in trajectory in a climbing flare landing...

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Rcpilot
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 11:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote #15   
AIRTHUG wrote:
Not an original thought to me- Roy Haggard pointed it out to me a while back, in a landing clinic I was giving for Wills Wing @ Wallaby


Do these landing clinics include any instruction on techniques for wheel landings, AIRTHUG?
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NMERider
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 12:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote #16   
Rcpilot wrote:
AIRTHUG wrote:
Not an original thought to me- Roy Haggard pointed it out to me a while back, in a landing clinic I was giving for Wills Wing @ Wallaby
Do these landing clinics include any instruction on techniques for wheel landings, AIRTHUG?
good idea thumbsup
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TjW
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 7:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote #17   
Rcpilot wrote:
AIRTHUG wrote:
Not an original thought to me- Roy Haggard pointed it out to me a while back, in a landing clinic I was giving for Wills Wing @ Wallaby


Do these landing clinics include any instruction on techniques for wheel landings, AIRTHUG?


Most people don't realize how heavy air actually is.
A cubic yard is about two pounds. For the metrically inclined, a cubic meter is about a kilogram.
When you consider the volume of air you wind up affecting, that's quite a mass.
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Windlord
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 9:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote #18   
Very nice Jonathan. thumbsup But I will point out that the color of your socks can be a bit distracting when landing. faint
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Roadrunner
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote #19   
Hey Jonathan I am just sitting on my Hands so to Speak. For I so want to fly my Predator again. Yes, I fantasizer about diving my Glider into the Juniper ridge L-Z. Where I would rrip along the Ground in that Down-Wind Up-Hill L-Z. I really did develope my Landing Skills up there on Mount Diablo. Jonathan, Get Tjhis: The Juniper ridge L-Z isa Down-Up-Hill L-Z. it was landing at the Juniper Ridge L-Z that I really got a: "FEEL FOR HOW TO INTERPRET, and it really was at Diablo that I fined tuned my landings. Jonathan, I had one Day where I ripped off 17 Flights of the Juniper Ridge Launch. Yes, I know how good it feels to rip a good Flair anxe have your flight where because you do a Very strong Flair. You Fell it in your harness when you Put the brakes on so to speak, By executting a well timed hard flair.

Ou how I want to fly again. I sure hope to keep the Juniper Ridge L-Z Whack Free.

See Ya Chris McKeon 9285-497-1059
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Rcpilot
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 12:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote #20   
NMERider wrote:
Rcpilot wrote:
AIRTHUG wrote:
Not an original thought to me- Roy Haggard pointed it out to me a while back, in a landing clinic I was giving for Wills Wing @ Wallaby
Do these landing clinics include any instruction on techniques for wheel landings, AIRTHUG?
good idea thumbsup


Note the predictable lack of a reply from Mr. AIRTHUG.
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