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SeeMarkFly
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Location: Lakeview Oregon
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 Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2011 8:59 am Post subject: How far behind is American health care? |
 #1 |
How far behind are we?
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| Canada's top medical journal is calling for an end to hospital parking charges, calling parking fees a barrier to health care that should be scrapped. |
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| The Ottawa neurologist says parking fees are causing needless stress for patients and families. |
The PARKING situation is causing needless stress!
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/health/Medical+journal+calls+hospitals+scrap+parking+fees/5779021/story.html
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HGXC
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Joined: 22 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2011 10:42 am Post subject: |
#2 |
When I went in for my surgery I was stressed about living and dying, where I would park my car was the last thing on my mind 
Dennis
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jjcote
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| Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:01 pm Post subject: |
#3 |
I think that's his point.
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Nicos
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| Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2011 8:20 pm Post subject: |
#4 |
| From what I understand, bout 50 years or so. |
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ChattaroyMan
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:11 am Post subject: |
#5 |
It should be called Corporation Care. If health were the main priority our system would be a lot different.
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HGXC
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 8:44 am Post subject: |
#6 |
| ChattaroyMan wrote: |
| It should be called Corporation Care. If health were the main priority our system would be a lot different. |
I will take corporate care over government care anyday. I soon will not have the choice 
Dennis
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Jason
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Joined: 02 Jan 2007
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Location: Stapleton, Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 9:12 am Post subject: |
#7 |
| HGXC wrote: |
| ChattaroyMan wrote: |
| It should be called Corporation Care. If health were the main priority our system would be a lot different. |
I will take corporate care over government care anyday. I soon will not have the choice
Dennis |
this is true....because there is no such thing as "government care" as the health care bill had no public option
leaving the choice "corporate care" or "corporate care"
I would think you are *((%ing estatic
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jjcote
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 9:36 am Post subject: |
#8 |
Right now there is an option, but it's being taken away. That option is called "No care".
(Actually, "No care" will still be available if you really want it, but not at the previous incredible bargain price. I don't think there are many people who actually want "No care" for themselves, although there may be some who think that other people should have it.)
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ChattaroyMan
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:03 am Post subject: |
#9 |
The problem with 'no care' and not having a public option is two fold - our planet is not getting smaller (diseases can and will spread more rapidly with increased population density) and that children are dependent on the financial situation of their parents (if they have both). FACT - the chance of a child under five of dying in the USA is greater than industrialised nations with universal health coverage.
To me, the "life" in "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" should mean affordable (or free) healthcare for all (chance at the best health one can have without a price tag placed on it). I do not mind in the least paying higher taxes to support a more healthy populace. I also feel it all boils down to how human we are. We've done a pretty darn decent job of creating a society where for the most part we get along, enjoy the fruits of our labors and follow laws set forth by ourselves (as in our government - which is us). But, we can improve and we'll need to do so as we make a much larger dent in the resources of our planet. I was born in 1952. The world's population then was 2.6X billion. It is now 7 billion. It will be around 8 billion in 14-15 years. We can't keep doing the same old, same old with an ever increasing world population. And when I use the word "can't" I don't mean "shouldn't". Quality and affordability of healthcare will effect each and every one of us - sooner or later.
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HGXC
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Joined: 22 Jul 2006
Posts: 2921
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:13 pm Post subject: |
#10 |
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To me, the "life" in "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" should mean affordable (or free) healthcare for all
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Although that is a nice thought its just isn't possible and or affordable. Everyone is free to determine their destiny and yes some have an easier path then others. Life is never fair. That said I never would want my care restricted to some government protocols and the idea that a decent portion of the health care delivery is a benefit of a ones compensation is not a bad way to go. It motivates people to take their "career" seriously. There are many flaws that happen because people are removed from the price negotiation part of the deal. That can be addressed, raising the age of adult children to be on their patients plan also takes care of some of the issue of young person just starting out on their own. Including cobra payments to the people on unemployment helps will help those looking for work.
We need to allow insurance companies to cross state lines and sell policy's nationally to increase competition.
But food, shelter and energy are not free and chances are you will starve or freeze before you will die from a disease. Anything given freely gets abused and rewards non productivity.
Dennis
I have been intensly involoved is all aspects of health care through out my life, from administration to health care provider to patient.
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jjcote
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:18 pm Post subject: |
#11 |
| HGXC wrote: |
| Quote: |
To me, the "life" in "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" should mean affordable (or free) healthcare for all
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Although that is a nice thought its just isn't possible and or affordable. |
You need to get out more.
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JR
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:30 pm Post subject: |
#12 |
Almost ever other wealthy, industrialized nation on the planet provides for basic health care for their citizens and their socialized medical programs are more cost-effective. We need a single-payer option and universal health care for everyone!
http://www.pnhp.org/news/2008/january/singlepayer_system_.php
JR |
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HGXC
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:54 pm Post subject: |
#13 |
| jjcote wrote: |
| HGXC wrote: |
| Quote: |
To me, the "life" in "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" should mean affordable (or free) healthcare for all
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Although that is a nice thought its just isn't possible and or affordable. |
You need to get out more. |
What are we as a country 14 trillion down! No JJ you need to get out more, and read a bit about all those industrialize rich nations about to go bankrupt.
What is wrong with earning your way? It seems to be a foreign concept with a few. I already took care of the unemployed and young adult living at home with a few policy changes in my previous post. There are two very large problems with health care. One is raising costs of treatment itself and the insurance to cover. Two is the increasing amounts of freeloaders on the system. The freeloader part is over. Allowing insurance companies to compete over state lines will help check some of the increase in cost.
Dennis
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ChattaroyMan
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:54 pm Post subject: |
#14 |
| HGXC wrote: |
| Although that is a nice thought its just isn't possible and or affordable...... |
Yeah, I'll bet the Wright brothers woulda thunk a person was nuts if they'd said we'd be 'flying' to Moon within 60-70 years. One heck of a lot is possible if folks have their priorities aligned. Sadly, too many people won't think much beyond themselves. We're not all the same (thankfully). But, we're all in the same boat and we'd better darn well begin to act like it or we're on a sinking ship.
I understand the reluctancy to want to provide healthcare to individuals who flat out abuse their own health. But, if someone grows up with good healthcare they're much more likely to treat themselves better - better than growing up to emulate a parent hooked on whatever. We just took my 84 year old mother to a local ER a week ago Sunday night. She had a bit of a wait due to a few folks there who were taking smoking breaks and were only there because they had a bad cold. Clogging ERs for folks that don't need emergency care is a result of the healthcare system we currently have - to the detriment of the folks who need emergency care. I'd like to think we're a nation that is smarter than that - perhaps I am wrong.
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HGXC
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Joined: 22 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:07 pm Post subject: |
#15 |
| Quote: |
| we're on a sinking ship. |
Yes we are I agree. Taking on more debt by providing more free health care then we already are is not going to keep anyone afloat. If you want to stay on the boat….start paddling.
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| But, if someone grows up with good healthcare they're much more likely to treat themselves better – |
I don’t know of any study that supports this and its not my job to see that someone treats themselves better.
| Quote: |
| We just took my 84 year old mother to a local ER a week ago Sunday night. She had a bit of a wait due to a few folks there who were taking smoking breaks and were only there because they had a bad cold. Clogging ERs for folks that don't need emergency care is a result of the healthcare system we currently have |
I agree and I would not allow them access to the ER, but triage them to a walk in clinic and get treated by a Physician’s Assistant. Each community needs to resolve their own local health care access issues. Not the role or responsibility of the Feds.
Dennis
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wilburleft
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:12 pm Post subject: |
#16 |
| HGXC wrote: |
| jjcote wrote: |
| HGXC wrote: |
| Quote: |
To me, the "life" in "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" should mean affordable (or free) healthcare for all
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Although that is a nice thought its just isn't possible and or affordable. |
You need to get out more. |
What are we as a country 14 trillion down! No JJ you need to get out more, and read a bit about all those industrialize rich nations about to go bankrupt.
What is wrong with earning your way? It seems to be a foreign concept with a few. I already took care of the unemployed and young adult living at home with a few policy changes in my previous post. There are two very large problems with health care. One is raising costs of treatment itself and the insurance to cover. Two is the increasing amounts of freeloaders on the system. The freeloader part is over. Allowing insurance companies to compete over state lines will help check some of the increase in cost.
Dennis |
I think most people who have health insurance can easier afford it because it is subsidized by their employer, and because their employer pays them a salary that makes it more affordable. Where does the employer get the money to pay salaries and health insurance? By selling their product or service to consumers. So in effect, all the American consumers are paying for the health insurance of the those who have it. |
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ChattaroyMan
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Joined: 01 Nov 2009
Posts: 1804
Location: Chattaroy, WA -USA
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:37 pm Post subject: |
#17 |
| HGXC wrote: |
| .....Taking on more debt ..... |
We don't need to take on more debt. I said I'm fine with paying higher taxes - truthfully - ever since I spent 6 months in Sudan when there were more Ethiopian refugees from a famine than were Sudanese. When one is immersed in a society that has no government benefits one begins to look at things differently. Perhaps those who smoke or do illegal drugs could be targeted for paying a higher tax rate. Which would end up being an added incentive for young folks to lead a clean life. But, I just don't see the logic in my having to put up with a less ideal healthcare system just because someone else would abuse it. If so, then let the abusers pay more for it. And in the same breath - provide an avenue for abusers to get off what they are abusing rather than slapping them in prison where it costs us one heck of a lot more to care for them - and where they learn all sorts of new tricks. We're just flat out going to have to be more creative at problem solving as opposed to ignoring the problem in hopes that it will go away.
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slimchance
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:39 pm Post subject: |
#18 |
none of this will work until they take the drug companys off the stock market.
( required by law to make/maximize a profit) drugs for MS range from 1500$ a month to 20000$ a month. 
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HGXC
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:41 pm Post subject: |
#19 |
| wilburleft wrote: |
| HGXC wrote: |
| jjcote wrote: |
| HGXC wrote: |
| Quote: |
To me, the "life" in "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" should mean affordable (or free) healthcare for all
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Although that is a nice thought its just isn't possible and or affordable. |
You need to get out more. |
What are we as a country 14 trillion down! No JJ you need to get out more, and read a bit about all those industrialize rich nations about to go bankrupt.
What is wrong with earning your way? It seems to be a foreign concept with a few. I already took care of the unemployed and young adult living at home with a few policy changes in my previous post. There are two very large problems with health care. One is raising costs of treatment itself and the insurance to cover. Two is the increasing amounts of freeloaders on the system. The freeloader part is over. Allowing insurance companies to compete over state lines will help check some of the increase in cost.
Dennis |
I think most people who have health insurance can easier afford it because it is subsidized by their employer, and because their employer pays them a salary that makes it more affordable. Where does the employer get the money to pay salaries and health insurance? By selling their product or service to consumers. So in effect, all the American consumers are paying for the health insurance of the those who have it. |
Yes that's absolutly right! Part of the free market system.
Dennis
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Nicos
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Location: Canberra, Australia
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:52 pm Post subject: |
#20 |
| HGXC wrote: |
| Quote: |
To me, the "life" in "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" should mean affordable (or free) healthcare for all
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Although that is a nice thought its just isn't possible and or affordable. |
This is clearly not true (it's merely an opinion). There are other countries who have a good public health system, yes.
It strikes me that the best thing a developed country can do (for it's own health & future) is to provide:
FREE education
FREE healthcare
SOME kind of welfare. |
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