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Rick M
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Joined: 22 Apr 2007
Posts: 1071
Location: Denver, Colorado, U.S.A.
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 Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 8:44 pm Post subject: We're like a bunch of religious zealots |
 #1 |
It just occurred to me this evening while typing up a reply to another post.
First off, I'm a devout atheist. I'm generally annoyed by religious zealots and "I found Jesus" types that just have to go out of their way to tell me what I'm missing out on. That's great for them but leave me alone.
Now I feel like I'm part of a cult trying to spread the word. Telling anyone we see. "You just have to try this. The experience is unbelievable."
Seeing Lobido's post about flying his Falcon Saturday made me think "That must be what someone feels like when they "find Jesus". Maybe. I don't know.
Kind a weird, isn't it?
I'm not sure what emoticon to use for this post. It's tongue-in-cheek but half serious too. I never thought I would be able to relate to how those religious types felt, but now I do. I hope no one takes this post the wrong way. I'm not knocking anyone here. It just made me think a bit - I know, bad idea.
Ouch, what was that? Oh, my mind just opened up a tiny bit more 
Maybe I'm just bored. I'm in a dark hotel room listening to my 6 year old son snore in the bed next to me. We're going skiing tomorrow at Copper Mountain.
Enjoy.
_________________
Rick
Hang 3 - WW U2 160
FL - ST - FSL - AT - TUR
"Once you have flown you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you long to return" -- Leonardo da Vinci
Last edited by Rick M on Sat Jan 12, 2008 9:54 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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JDyer
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Joined: 29 Jan 2007
Posts: 703
Location: Alberta Canada
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 8:55 pm Post subject: |
#2 |
I couldn't agree more.
Religion is the root of all evil. We should start a cult religion involving rules of flight hrs per year and all should have to go to the mecca (owens? australia?) at least once every 5 years. drinking is mandatory.... I'm sure it would be awesome. |
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hgflyer
3 thumbs up
Joined: 07 Dec 2007
Posts: 3425
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 9:03 pm Post subject: |
#3 |
personal verve is just that, personal.
Be respectful where you share it and how you share it.
Het Gigh Fo Gar.................................Go in peace now my underlings..........................................................
I'm open to anyone who wants to throw a stone at me? Be careful. I dont have health insurance. |
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Lobido
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Joined: 24 Jun 2007
Posts: 4099
Location: St. Croix, US Virgin Islands
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 9:05 pm Post subject: |
#4 |
Touchy subject, religion. I am in awe of existence. What we do when we fly is icing on the cake. Does the experience give rise to spiritual moments? Undeniably. For those of us who do not have traditional beliefs, I think it can give a glimpse into the spirituality that the religious folks experience, albeit coming at it from a different angle. Whether one believes in a higher power or not, what we have in our existence is a wonder, indeed.
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I keep cuttin' it and cuttin' it, but it's still too short.
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Redbeard
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Joined: 07 Jul 2007
Posts: 1291
Location: Santa Shoes, California
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 9:11 pm Post subject: |
#5 |
somehow i imagine the e-team would require the sacrifice of a glider at some interval...rather than incense we would wave around varios, the "bible" would probably be a compilation of info from pilots that have some names we would recognize, like "Pagen" (hehe) "Tudor" "Heine"...
_________________
"Never Land On Your Face"
H3
FL~FSL~CL~AWCL~AT
The Hangar--> Moyes Litesport 4~Vision Mark IV 17~UP Gemini
check out my pics... http://flickr.com/photos/26902164@N08/ |
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knumbknuts
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Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 5004
Location: Carlsbad, CA
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 9:30 pm Post subject: |
#6 |
What on Earth is this post doing here?
Go away.
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Rick M
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Joined: 22 Apr 2007
Posts: 1071
Location: Denver, Colorado, U.S.A.
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 9:38 pm Post subject: |
#7 |
Thanks Lobido, your words do much more justice to what I was thinking.
I'm a fairly open minded person in general. There are many things I don't care for but I have no issues at all with people doing and believing what they want, as long as it's not bothering others in the process. I've never been religious or spiritual. But I've had a few moments that have but me in a position to wonder, briefly.
One was maybe 10 years ago. I was skiing at Keystone Colorado, I believe. It was closing time. It had been lightly snowing all day. I found myself near the top of a run on one of the peaks all alone. The chairs were shutdown for the day and most skiers had already gone down. I made a few turns and stopped. The pines were covered in white, there wasn't a sound to be heard. Snow felt lightly from the sky but visibility was still several miles. I stood there in the silence taking in the view. All alone with my thoughts. I'll never forget how I felt. I wish I was a poet to do this moment justice.
_________________
Rick
Hang 3 - WW U2 160
FL - ST - FSL - AT - TUR
"Once you have flown you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you long to return" -- Leonardo da Vinci |
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Rick M
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Joined: 22 Apr 2007
Posts: 1071
Location: Denver, Colorado, U.S.A.
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 9:43 pm Post subject: |
#8 |
| knumbknuts wrote: |
| What on Earth is this post doing here? |
The original intent was to compare our effort to grow the sport with how other folks try to grow their religion. Like I said originally, it's mostly tongue-in-cheek, but it can also be taken seriously depending on how you read it.
I was torn on putting it here vs. the camp fire. Feel free to move if you feel it's appropriate to do so.
Enjoy.
_________________
Rick
Hang 3 - WW U2 160
FL - ST - FSL - AT - TUR
"Once you have flown you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you long to return" -- Leonardo da Vinci |
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designbydave
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Joined: 28 Apr 2007
Posts: 2429
Location: Rancho Cucamonga, CA
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 9:45 pm Post subject: |
#9 |
I too am a hard core Atheist, but I do not mind having people tell me about Jesus.
I believe in the "market-place of ideas." I think we should all have our ideas and feel free to share them with others. (Religion often takes an aggressive approach to sharing though...)
When the Jes-ites (as I call them) try to preach to me, I like to turn it around on them and put the burden of proof where it belongs, on them. I point out all the logical fallacies the the Jesus story, or Religion itself. Its fun!
I don't think there is anything wrong with talking about Hang Gliding like it's the best thing ever. Its just another idea in a vast market place 
_________________
-Dave
http://www.designbydave.net/ |
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phantomflier
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Joined: 15 Nov 2006
Posts: 845
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 10:01 pm Post subject: |
#10 |
| Quote: |
| Touchy subject, religion. I am in awe of existence. What we do when we fly is icing on the cake. Does the experience give rise to spiritual moments? Undeniably. For those of us who do not have traditional beliefs, I think it can give a glimpse into the spirituality that the religious folks experience, albeit coming at it from a different angle. Whether one believes in a higher power or not, what we have in our existence is a wonder, indeed. |
Flying, for me, IS a religious experience. I feel closer to God when I fly. I regularly pray as part of my preflight and as a believer in eternal principles , I know if my glider goes down, I'll be heading right back UP. Many bad human beings have done terrible things invoking the name of God, but that doesn't change who God is. Having faith in the creator of the universe is most certainly NOT the root of all evil. I have seen too many lives heading for ruin, get touched by the hand of God in a miraculous way. I would never use this forum to push my beliefs on others, but I can't let a ignorant comment like that go un- challenged. |
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designbydave
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Joined: 28 Apr 2007
Posts: 2429
Location: Rancho Cucamonga, CA
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 10:13 pm Post subject: |
#11 |
| phantomflier wrote: |
| Having faith in the creator of the universe is most certainly NOT the root of all evil. |
I agree. But that is not what is meant when someone claims that Religion is the root of all evil.
I fell that Religion (and by Religion, I mean religious institutions, Christianity, Islam, Scientology, etc...) plays a part in a larger evil that is control.
Claiming that Religion is THE root of all evil is an over simplification. There are plenty of evils, greed comes to mind.
But then again, if one wants to discuss evil, they must understand that evil, like most things, is relative. Most people would claim the 911 hijackers to be evil. Yet if you examine evil from the 911 hijackers perspective, WE are evil. (BTW a lot of people like to equate a terrorist to a psychotic lunatics bent on cold murder. This is the opposite of a terrorist. They act with purpose and reason.)
...oh no, you guys got me started!  , I could keep going for days! Quick someone post another HG vs PG thread, or a video of their first flights at Elsinore (hehe, coming soon!) so we can get back to the Hang gliding discussions! 
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-Dave
http://www.designbydave.net/ |
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sg
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Joined: 17 Jul 2006
Posts: 11030
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 10:27 pm Post subject: |
#12 |
A RELIGION THREAD ON HANGGLIDING.ORG?!!?!?!?!??!??!?!?!?!??! 
Im having a heart attack right about now. Please dont let this blow up
_________________
H4, AT, FL, TFL, AWCL, CL, FSL, RLF, TUR, X-C
Aeros Stealth III 142
| Thomas Jefferson wrote: |
| All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent. |
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el_loco
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Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 159
Location: Kongsberg, Norway
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| Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 5:36 am Post subject: |
#13 |
youtube.com/watch?v=MeSSwKffj9o  |
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Thog
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Joined: 29 Sep 2007
Posts: 207
Location: Millersport, Ohio
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| Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 5:52 am Post subject: |
#14 |
| Quote: |
| Im having a heart attack right about now. Please dont let this blow up |
What are you afraid of SG? As I look back on the hundreds of threads on this site, I see topics on just about everything in the world. Why not bounce around a few ideas about religion? If things do blow up, it would not be because of the Jes-ites. I like Dave's observation...sometimes the problem is with institutions. If you really want to know the root beliefs of a religion, look to it's founder and not necessarily to those who think they are following him or her.
In reference to "evil," who determines what evil is? Jesus was certainly clear about defining evil. To me, the ultimate evil is summed up by hate and murder. Let's see, the god or "founder" of atheism is evolution and the idea that everything we see came from absolutely nothing with absolutely no higher cause. If I understand it correctly, evolutionary processes in the biological world are determined by natural selection, survival of the fittest, "eat or be eaten" if you will. Hmmmm, evil = hate and murder. Evloution = survival of the fittest (a nice way of saying murder). Sounds like evolution is founded on murder, so I guess that makes evolutionary ideas the root of all evil.
(Insert tongue-in-cheek icon here)
As a Jes-ite, I enjoy these conversations. I wouldn't ever think of eliminating others because they don't agree with me. I'll be honest Rick, sometimes I feel badly because, at times, I share my enthusiam about hang gliding with others more openly than I do about my faith.
Just put up with us Jes-ites, everyone. I never want to be obnixious about finding Jesus. But to quote a song from a few years back "If you know a wonderful secret, you tell it to your friends. A lifetime filled with happiness is like a street that never ends." If your faith makes you happy, share it. If flying free like an eagle makes you happy, share it. It would be selfish not to do so!
If you don't like this thread the answer is simple. Don't read it. There are plenty of others from which to choose!!
Mark |
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ClandestineSwine
3 thumbs up
Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 322
Location: Atlanta, GA
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| Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 6:00 am Post subject: |
#15 |
| Thog wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Im having a heart attack right about now. Please dont let this blow up |
What are you afraid of SG? As I look back on the hundreds of threads on this site, I see topics on just about everything in the world. Why not bounce around a few ideas about religion? |
Religion and politics are "No-no's". This isn't a religious forum, nor one for politics.
These discussions typically devovle into animosity and alienation. We are trying to build a community, not destroy it. |
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Avnav8r
3 thumbs up
Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 994
Location: Trenton, Georgia
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| Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 6:38 am Post subject: |
#16 |
Hey,
What if you got sucked up into a huge cu-nim, spun around and around, finally spit out and you where back in time some 3000 years ago. The people who observed you land would probably make you a god and build a religion around you (if they don't eat you first). Oh, wait a minute, this is an idea I'm gonna pitch as a sit-com-Gilligan's LZ.
John Stokes |
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SkyOrDie47
1 thumbs up
Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 97
Location: SoCal
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| Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 7:26 am Post subject: |
#17 |
| JDyer wrote: |
Religion is the root of all evil. |
Heh! You stole my line! I've been using this one for years whenever the subject of religion comes up. If further conversation ensues, I nip it in the bud by referring them to the 6:00 news. In case of emergencies I have a treatise on the evolution of religion in my back pocket. |
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fly n mater
3 thumbs up
Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 725
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| Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 8:15 am Post subject: |
#18 |
| SkyOrDie47 wrote: |
Heh! You stole my line! I've been using this one for years whenever the subject of religion comes up. If further conversation ensues, I nip it in the bud by referring them to the 6:00 news. In case of emergencies I have a treatise on the evolution of religion in my back pocket. |
You are looking at this wrong. One of the greatest tenants of Christianity is freedom of will. YOU are free to choose. The news is only reporting what people have chosen to do. God knocks at your door every day but he doesn't come barging in on you. You are free to open the door or keep it closed.
Now, let go flying. |
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sg
3 thumbs up
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
Posts: 11030
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| Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 8:35 am Post subject: |
#19 |
| ClandestineSwine wrote: |
| Thog wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Im having a heart attack right about now. Please dont let this blow up |
What are you afraid of SG? As I look back on the hundreds of threads on this site, I see topics on just about everything in the world. Why not bounce around a few ideas about religion? |
Religion and politics are "No-no's". This isn't a religious forum, nor one for politics.
These discussions typically devovle into animosity and alienation. We are trying to build a community, not destroy it. |
Exactly. I cant think of a more divisive topic. I will lock this thread down the moment it becomes uncivil before it escalates and spins out of control.
_________________
H4, AT, FL, TFL, AWCL, CL, FSL, RLF, TUR, X-C
Aeros Stealth III 142
| Thomas Jefferson wrote: |
| All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent. |
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knumbknuts
3 thumbs up
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 5004
Location: Carlsbad, CA
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| Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 8:39 am Post subject: |
#20 |
This is the very last thing I want to see when I come to hanggliding.org. There is an internet-correctness rule that says it's okay to bash religion. Or, ding it, slight it, make fun of various beliefs.
hg.org is a happy place... the first site I check in the AM, last before I crash.
I would rather see the tattoo on Rosie O'Donnell's ass than see this topic, or any like it, here. |
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