I had an issue with NorthWing too, something a lot different.
I ordered a new down tube from them last year for my Mark IV, I talked to them on the phone about it and then they took my order down of what I needed.
3 weeks later I get a down tube for a Horizon wing which is an airfoil design with the safety edge inserted in the leading edge of the down tube.
I called them back and got it straight. I sent the tube back and in 3 more weeks I got the one I needed (finally)
Then I ordered a King Post for my wing, again talked to them on the phone and they weren't sure if they had on in stock or had to make it.
They said for me to call back the next day when such and such person would be in the shop so they could look and see if they had one.
Well needless to say, I could never get hold of anyone about it after several phone calls and when I did finally talk to someone they just gave me the typical run around and I never found out if they actually had my part or not!
This was over around 4 months ago.
I mean I got what I wanted from another source but until this day they never contacted me again.
I'm done with NW I will never buy anything from them again.
One day when I can purchase a new wing I think I'll go with Moyes simply because I like their design, how they build there wings and the parts they use plus I hear they have really good service for their customers.
I had an issue with NorthWing too, something a lot different.
I ordered a new down tube from them last year for my Mark IV, I talked to them on the phone about it and then they took my order down of what I needed.
Did you know that they didn't make the Mark IV? That's like complaining about Chevy service getting replacement parts for your Delorean. _________________ Real freedom lies in wildness, not in civilization.
Charles Lindbergh
I had an issue with NorthWing too, something a lot different.
I ordered a new down tube from them last year for my Mark IV, I talked to them on the phone about it and then they took my order down of what I needed.
Did you know that they didn't make the Mark IV? That's like complaining about Chevy service getting replacement parts for your Delorean.
Yes I knew they didn't make the 4 but when they said they carry a complete line of parts for the glider since it was designed then that changes everything thus making them a parts dealer and having an obligation to uphold as advertised. At least this is what they told me when I contacted them the first time. Also LMFP get parts from them for Pulse gliders and Mark IV's from what LM said.
Did you know that supposedly Matt Taber of LMFP actually designed the Mark IV back in the day? He told me that himself when I mentioned about buying the wing a couple of years ago.
It's the first time I've ever heard of Matt telling an HG pilot to buy a glider from another source besides himself LOL he talked very highly of it so I would purchase this wing. Now that was a first coming out of him!.
Did you know that supposedly Matt Taber of LMFP actually designed the Mark IV back in the day? He told me that himself when I mentioned about buying the wing a couple of years ago.
Matt didn't design the Mark IV, I can guarantee. _________________ Suppose you were an idiot.
And suppose you were a member of congress.
But I repeat myself.
- Mark Twain
Did you know that supposedly Matt Taber of LMFP actually designed the Mark IV back in the day? He told me that himself when I mentioned about buying the wing a couple of years ago.
Matt didn't design the Mark IV, I can guarantee.
and the title of this thread is "truth in marketing"
Did you know that supposedly Matt Taber of LMFP actually designed the Mark IV back in the day? He told me that himself when I mentioned about buying the wing a couple of years ago.
Matt didn't design the Mark IV, I can guarantee.
OK I'm all ears. Who actually designed it? does anyone know the person's name who really designed it?
Yeah back a couple of years ago I called Matt personally and was asking him about the Mark IV because I had a chance to buy a good wing for cheap (after I looked at it) and wanted any information he could give me on it. The wing was inspected and I purchased it from a private individual who knew Paul down at Quest.
The wing was at Quest. Paul and I set it up and looked it over a few days before I purchased it. Well the next day I called Matt because during my training there at LM I learned Matt dealt with spare parts for these wings and Pulses on a regular basis so I knew he dealt with the Mark IV.
Well after about 30 minutes into the conversation Matt said I should go ahead and buy it for the price it was selling for and then he said *I actually designed the Mark IV* those were his words and I'll never forget them. So I went back down to quest a few days later, we set it up again and I spent the day out there going over it and then brought it home.
I had no reason not to believe him but that wasn't what sold me either. Paul down there was very helpful and plus I seen the wing fly twice before even talking to Matt anyway but I just wanted to hear what Matt had to say so now you know.
Anyway, I doubt if I'll fly it again... it's a nice wing but man it took a lot of work to fly it at POTM with constant 15 to 20 mph winds. I mean it has one hell of a glide ratio on it but when it comes to handling it was tough in a lot of cases to get to go where you wanted it to go, I really had to wrestle it around.
You can see this in my video clip attached near my signature under my post.
Anyway... I had some nice times on it and got my money's worth by far.
I have proven we're getting lied to... This thread is about truth in marketing...
Nonsense as usual from a guy who has *defended * his own lies right here on this forum and has stated that he would lie *again* given the same scenario.
You have NOT proven any lie, and in fact you have *admitted* that the actual 1.5pt improvement in glide will likely actually occur at some speed. That's called the *opposite* of "proving a lie".
The only one lying here is you claiming that you've proved North Wing has lied.
ETA: Never owned a North Wing glider and likely never will -- just pointing out the fatal flaw in Ryans "truth in marketing" marketing.
JB
Last edited by BubbleBoy on Thu Jun 23, 2011 6:09 pm; edited 1 time in total
I know because I was there in the Salinas, CA factor at the time, helped with the hardware development, test flew many prototypes and likely built more components used in more MK IVs than anyone on earth.
Matt Tabor did NOT design the MK IV -- never *once* even stepping foot in the shop during it's development.
The Mark IV was the next step in the evolution of the original Vision, with the Eclipse in between. The Vision's keel pocket became the Eclipe's keel strap which eventually brought the keel up to the sail in the Mark IV.
It was designed by Jean-Michel Bernasconi, John LaTorre and a bunch of tweaking and assistance from Bob England.
I built pretty much all of them. Dana Corpuz assembled a few during the last year of their production and I moved on as the Pulse was taking over.
That said, Matt was our biggest customer and I'm sure he had a lot of discussions with JMB about the direction the product line was taking, but "designed"...?
Not so much. _________________ Suppose you were an idiot.
And suppose you were a member of congress.
But I repeat myself.
- Mark Twain
Anyway, I doubt if I'll fly it again... it's a nice wing but man it took a lot of work to fly it at POTM with constant 15 to 20 mph winds. I mean it has one hell of a glide ratio on it but when it comes to handling it was tough in a lot of cases to get to go where you wanted it to go, I really had to wrestle it around.
That's odd. I routinely fly my MarkIV in 15-20 mph winds at the beach, and I've never had any issues with handling. _________________ H4 + various skills (only foot-launch so far)
WW UltraSport 147, WW Falcon2 170, PacAir Vision Mark IV 17
My HG wiki profile and my flying blog
I know because I was there in the Salinas, CA factor at the time, helped with the hardware development, test flew many prototypes and likely built more components used in more MK IVs than anyone on earth.
JB
And playing a lot of basketball at break time...
_________________ Suppose you were an idiot.
And suppose you were a member of congress.
But I repeat myself.
- Mark Twain
The Mark IV was the next step in the evolution of the original Vision, with the Eclipse in between. The Vision's keel pocket became the Eclipe's keel strap which eventually brought the keel up to the sail in the Mark IV.
It was designed by Jean-Michel Bernasconi, John LaTorre and a bunch of tweaking and assistance from Bob England.
I built pretty much all of them. Dana Corpuz assembled a few during the last year of their production and I moved on as the Pulse was taking over.
That said, Matt was our biggest customer and I'm sure he had a lot of discussions with JMB about the direction the product line was taking, but "designed"...?
Anyway, I doubt if I'll fly it again... it's a nice wing but man it took a lot of work to fly it at POTM with constant 15 to 20 mph winds. I mean it has one hell of a glide ratio on it but when it comes to handling it was tough in a lot of cases to get to go where you wanted it to go, I really had to wrestle it around.
That's odd. I routinely fly my MarkIV in 15-20 mph winds at the beach, and I've never had any issues with handling.
Sounds like the one in question was either poorly tuned or had out-of-profile battens (or both). You should be able to throw that thing around with just a thought, regardless of the wind speeds. _________________ Suppose you were an idiot.
And suppose you were a member of congress.
But I repeat myself.
- Mark Twain
The Mark IV was the next step in the evolution of the original Vision, with the Eclipse in between. The Vision's keel pocket became the Eclipe's keel strap which eventually brought the keel up to the sail in the Mark IV.
It was designed by Jean-Michel Bernasconi, John LaTorre and a bunch of tweaking and assistance from Bob England.
I built pretty much all of them. Dana Corpuz assembled a few during the last year of their production and I moved on as the Pulse was taking over.
That said, Matt was our biggest customer and I'm sure he had a lot of discussions with JMB about the direction the product line was taking, but "designed"...?
Not so much.
Hi Briggs. :-)
(hope that wasn't supposed to be a secret).
JB
If it was, it was pretty poorly kept...! I'm guessing most of the old farts in here knew who I was... _________________ Suppose you were an idiot.
And suppose you were a member of congress.
But I repeat myself.
- Mark Twain
And got my ass kicked 100% of the time by you and Dana. Good times.
JB
That's 'cause Dana was good...I was pretty much a pylon... _________________ Suppose you were an idiot.
And suppose you were a member of congress.
But I repeat myself.
- Mark Twain
Anyway, I doubt if I'll fly it again... it's a nice wing but man it took a lot of work to fly it at POTM with constant 15 to 20 mph winds. I mean it has one hell of a glide ratio on it but when it comes to handling it was tough in a lot of cases to get to go where you wanted it to go, I really had to wrestle it around.
That's odd. I routinely fly my MarkIV in 15-20 mph winds at the beach, and I've never had any issues with handling.
Yeah tell me about it. Ya know ever since my very first flight on that thing something just didn't seem right. It just seemed like it was warped or something odd was happening during flight. Yeah I know, It's the operator hehe... no not really.
Sometimes it flew great and other times it seem to have a mind of it's own and this I noticed in the same conditions. I checked all the battens according to the batten blue print, they were all right on the money. I checked for odd measurements of the sail mounted on the wing tips as to make sure the sail was centered and mounted evenly from what I could tell and checked a few other things that I thought might be causing weird flight characteristics.
I could never find anything except for one minor issue.
The bottom battens (four of them) were the same. There are two of the four which are slightly shorter then the other two. The longer one go's inside towards the pilot and the shorter go's outside because of the taper of the wing, OK normal, no prob and both sets of these battens are the same size... BUT! when inserted in the wing in the exact location they are suppose to be, one set of the battens do not come close to touching the center crossbar and the other side rest upon the crossbar as they were intended to do because of the shaped tips or saddle tips which are shaped with a curve to match the curve of the crossbar. This prevents the battens from getting pushed up passed the crossbar thus keeping the bottom of the double surface flat.
Well I had to push one side of battens in further so they would rest on the crossbar, that's fine but one thing you have to think about. If one side doe's not naturally fit like the other and I had to push these battens further in the sleeve to get them to rest on the crossbar then there has to be something wrong or slanted with the sail itself or the crossbar is out of whack or something so this is why I think it's whacked somehow, that's the only thing I can figure why it just don't seem to fly right sometimes. Something just seems twisted and it was like that when I purchased it but I didn't notice it until after I got it back home and before flying it.
OK sorry for getting off topic here, Maybe we should put this on another post somewhere?
any ideas bout this?
....and I flew it anyway! LOL damn test pilots!. _________________
Are the tips free to rotate? On the MarkIV, I believe you should be able to grab hold of the tip, and rotate it up and down a bit in pitch, the hardware out there is built to allow for some rotation. If grit gets in between the tubes, they can get wedged up. Maybe you have just enough grit that it seizes up some of the time? You can undo the velcro and pull out the tubes and clean that stuff out. _________________ H4 + various skills (only foot-launch so far)
WW UltraSport 147, WW Falcon2 170, PacAir Vision Mark IV 17
My HG wiki profile and my flying blog
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